Just introducing myself

[novocals]

Hi I'm Tim - I'm new to the meat-free lifestyle (I'm currently a vegetarian trying to transition to vegan, but it's very difficult) and a long time Agnostic (I think that is when you believe there is some type of higher power or creator, you just do not know what it is). I've been Agnostic ever since I was a kid. I would always ask adults how to know for sure if God from the Bible was real, and if Jesus Christ was really the son of God, and if Noah's Ark and other stories from the Bible really happened. The only answer I would ever get was that I had to have faith and that just wasn't enough for me. I can't see molding my entire life around something that I can't even be provided proof is real. I do, however, believe in a creator of some sort, some sort of judgement day and some sort of life after death. I just can't fathom the fact that when we die it just ends. And as much as anyone tries to convince me with "but what about before you were born??" it will not change my thought process because many have tried before to no avail. Anyway, like I said at the moment I am not totally vegan due to it being so difficult. I am mostly vegan but do have an occasional dessert or veggie pizza when eating out with the family. One very hard part for me is that I am a single dad of two kids, one of whom has chosen to be a vegetarian with minimal dairy consumption as well, but my other says she cannot stop eating meat or drinking milk. I have to prepare food for all of us and before it was tough but now it has become that much more difficult. I've never been that much of a cook so at the moment my son basically eats PB&J sandwiches everyday because he refuses to eat meat. As far as why I chose this lifestyle, the usual reasons. I've never been into hunting or fishing basically due to feeling bad for hurting animals so this only makes sense for me. I am 38 years old and the only reason it has taken me this long to make the switch is that basically I just never really realized what was going on. I mean, I heard this and that but never really thought too much until a vegan friend of mine said "man you should watch some videos on YouTube." When I saw certain videos such as Farm to Fridge, Earthlings, etc., I decided that I just couldn't support this bullshit any longer. And on top of that, you have all the environmental and health issues, including processed meat be labeled as a Level 1 Carcinogen by the World Health Organization. Now that I've educated myself, I'm very angry at the human race. I often find myself wanting to isolate myself from family, friends and coworkers due to being so upset at them for not caring about what they are contributing to. I still go on going through the motions and living my normal life, but I am glad I found this forum because this may help with my anger and keep me out of trouble.

[brimstoneSalad]

Hi Tim, welcome.

Regarding your kids; you are the father, they really shouldn't be demanding unhealthy and unethical foods from you. This culture of children demanding things from parents, and parents always giving in, can be problematic when the kids ask for things that are bad for them. It doesn't help them to always give them what they want -- childhood obesity rates alone should be evidence of this, but what she eats now will also establish habit for the rest of her life, and she will die an early death if she doesn't learn good food choices now.

Remember, your responsibility it to provide them with good nutrition, and to respect their moral compasses. If a child won't eat meat for moral reasons, that totally makes sense. If a child demands meat because she just wants it... that's more or less like demanding beer or cigarettes. She has no moral reason to refuse vegetables, whole grains, etc. so you aren't violating her ethics by not giving her junk.

What if she demanded alcohol and smokes? We know animals products can be just as unhealthy as those.

It would be best if she made her own decision, definitely, but while under your roof, she has no right to demand junk food.

Have you shown her the movies you have seen? Earthlings, Farm to Fridge, etc.? Please don't underestimate kids; when provided with the right information, they can very often make the right decisions by themselves. Sometimes we're overprotective of our children from the realities of the world -- but that's another modern habit that probably isn't doing them any favors. They may cry for a bit, but then they get over it, and they can grow as people.


Regarding religion: It seems like you're talking about some form of deism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism
Does that seem to describe your beliefs?

[novocals]

Good stuff and I completely agree.

I didn't mention it, but she is only 7, so the 'demanding' thing really doesn't apply. They eat what I provide. I have just decided to not make them completely switch when they have been eating meat for 7 years, but we are certainly moving in that direction. She and my son are actually eating vegan spaghetti as I type (and they both said it is delicious). They are also undersized, so I'm concerned with nutrition. It is a struggle to get them to eat most veggies, so I worry about that too. Anyway, we are definitely trying to make the switch, so I'm proud of that.

As far as the movies, she is a little young for that, of course, but I'll definitely be showing them when I think she is old enough that it will not 'ruin her childhood' or give her nightmares or anything. My son, who is the same age, has stumbled across one (I didn't realize he was standing behind me watching my screen) which I believe is why he has chosen to make the transition. He could only handle about 30 seconds of Farm to Fridge before I noticed him running off and crying. After seeing just that little bit, he made the choice, which shows me he will grow up to be a logical, compassionate & caring human being.

I'll research Deism and let you know what I think.

Thanks for the welcome, and the reply!

[novocals]

Re: Deism

I read a little bit. I'll agree that my beliefs are similar to Deism. I'm just not the type who has to have a label on everything. It's just my personal beliefs and they are not going to be exactly the same as any organized religion. Honestly, I've thought about it before, and if I was starting a new religion, I think Water would be the God. Not a water god such as Poseidon, but actual water.

[brimstoneSalad]

I have just decided to not make them completely switch when they have been eating meat for 7 years, but we are certainly moving in that direction.

The important thing is to make sure they have good nutrition, so that the meat and other animal products aren't just replaced with something non-nutritious like rice.

The most important thing is to get them eating beans. And you may want to choose a multivitamin for them.

Definitely B-12 and vitamin D, and probably calcium as well.

Follow these recommendations for supplements:
http://veganhealth.org/articles/dailyrecs

And use this website to track all of your diets:

https://cronometer.com/

If you input all of your daily food, that will tell you what you're missing.
Let us know how it turns out, and we can give suggestions for any shortcomings in the diet.

http://www.amazon.com/Nature-Made-Vitam ... 2+1000+mcg

Give them each one of these twice a week. You can also choose a brand that's 500 mcg since they're younger (you should have 1,000 mcg for yourself though).

They are also undersized, so I'm concerned with nutrition. It is a struggle to get them to eat most veggies, so I worry about that too. Anyway, we are definitely trying to make the switch, so I'm proud of that.

Do you have a blender or food processor? If not, that's one of the most important investments you can make.

It's much easier to get kids to eat veggies when they're blended up in things. We'll help you learn some easy things to make and hide veggies in.

Make home-made vegan pizzas, and blend up some veggies into the sauce, for example. Make smoothies, and add a little vegetable along with berries. It can take some work to get kids to eat their veggies, but there are lots of tricks you'll learn.

You can use cauliflower to make a vegan cheese for the top of a pizza too.

As far as the movies, she is a little young for that, of course, but I'll definitely be showing them when I think she is old enough that it will not 'ruin her childhood' or give her nightmares or anything.

Kids recover fast, and particularly at seven. Think about how you were at seven (you can probably remember some things from then). It may make them sad for a bit, yes, but that's an important part of learning about the world around us. It doesn't ruin a childhood to learn about reality, that's what a childhood is all about.
Sheltering is more likely to create adults who have trouble with reality. The earlier we learn the better we handle things in the long run without the denial reflex so many of us have to struggle with.

[novocals]

I appreciate the response. You provided a lot of useful info and I'm going to consider your suggestions.

[Joel.LM]

Hey buddy, I saw you posted on mine, so ill post on yours. Welcome, don't associate your self with me too much, I have a feeling I may stir the pot a tad. A well, what's life with out a bit of excitement eh?

[brimstoneSalad]

Hey buddy, I saw you posted on mine, so ill post on yours. Welcome, don't associate your self with me too much, I have a feeling I may stir the pot a tad. A well, what's life with out a bit of excitement eh?

Stirred pots are the best kinds of pots!