Philosophical Vegan Forum

@brimstoneSalad, what do you think about what my psychiatrist says about prisons, that prisons serve the purpose of deterring some mentally healthy people from murdering?

BrimstoneSalad doesn't seem to be posting much, at least not on some of the threads I've been on. How are you doing lately Teo? Hope you are doing well.

teo123 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 17, 2021 11:56 pm

Jebus wrote: It just makes zero sense to believe that someone who is scared of needles, would have the courage to do himself in.

My friend, I don't know about you, but I think it takes courage to continue living in this mad world of house arrests and mandatory face covers. Who knows what is next? I mean, sure, once it will all end and people will (mostly falsely) claim they were against that all along but were afraid to speak up, but how long until that day comes? And who knows what will come before that day? Concentration camps do not seem inconceivable. It also does not seem inconceivable I will be put in one.

Teo. Wrong about flat Earth. Corrected on that, finally. Wrong about bombs. Corrected on that, finally. Wrong about prisons not existing. Corrected on that, finally.

Currently wrong about pandemic response policies.

There's a popular "definition" of insanity that goes something like this: Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. It's crude, but it describes *some* insanity. In this case, yours: You try again and again to come up with these counter-consensus beliefs to feel like you've discovered some big secret or conspiracy, and again and again you are wrong.

I'm not going to argue virology with you AGAIN. You don't understand any of this, and any inkling that you do is Dunning Kruger (AGAIN). You need to accept that and stop trying to outsmart everybody else.

I have a lot to say about the problems with public pandemic policy, bit YOU opposing public policy on the pandemic is wrong because you've proven historically to be incapable of being reliably sensible, and it's only doing two things:
1. Reinforcing the social harm that Covid-denial spreads
2. Making you feel depressed because you feel like the man is unjustifiably oppressing you.

Policies aren't perfect, but you don't have the capacity to understand what's wrong with them so strop trying to.
Just give it up already Teo. Wear a flimsy piece of cloth, and stop giving a shit at people are being made to do so.

Delta isn't as big of a deal, and the good news it that the higher infection rate means that it's acting as a living vaccine against more dangerous variants. Between rising vaccination rates and Delta we'll hit herd immunity very soon and this will blow over -- aside from the yearly Covid booster you'll find in the yearly flu shot you should already be taking.



Also, regarding suicide: Look into quantum immortality. Your attempt will always fail from your perspective (just cause traumatic emotional harm to the 99.999% of universes where it succeeded and hurt your family). However, that doesn't mean you can't end up with more severe permanent injury or another form of brain damage that leaves your train of consciousness in place.

Jump off a building or even shoot yourself in the head, and you'll wake up in some moderately improbable universe (that inherently must exist): but with the probable outcome of being paralyzed now.

If that's true (and the math suggests it is) then does suicide really sound like a good plan?

brimstoneSalad wrote:You try again and again to come up with these counter-consensus beliefs to feel like you've discovered some big secret or conspiracy, and again and again you are wrong.

But, you know, if you make a lot of reasonable guesses, you will sooner or later end up right about something, by chance alone. That is how science works, right? Now, what is a reasonable guess is hard to define. I am quite sure my guess about what the name Karašica means is reasonable, as my mathematics professor Tomislav Rudec tells me my arguments seem compelling to him.

brimstoneSalad wrote:You need to accept that and stop trying to outsmart everybody else.

Oh, but, you know, groupthink is at least as dangerous as trying to outsmart everybody else is. Groupthink is how Holocaust and Lysenkoism happened: they came from compliance, rather than uncompliance. I have yet to hear of a major catastrophe that happened from a lack of groupthink.
Furthermore, I cannot pick and choose what I believe. Belief is a result of becoming convinced. I am not convinced by what a bunch of non-experts (in a multidisciplinary field nobody is qualified to talk about, such as pandemic response) think.

brimstoneSalad wrote:Look into quantum immortality.

Does not that sound too terrifying to be true? Also, don't the vast majority of physicists subscribe either to the Copenhagen Interpretation or the Pilot Wave Theory, not to the Many Worlds Interpretation?

teo123 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 7:57 am But, you know, if you make a lot of reasonable guesses, you will sooner or later end up right about something, by chance alone. That is how science works, right? Now, what is a reasonable guess is hard to define.

The problem with you is that you go far outside the envelope of what would be considered reasonable. I know, I know, you still think your reasons for believing that bombs and prisons don't exist were reasonable, but considering the scope of the conspiracy, AND the mountains empirical evidence otherwise, it doesn't come close to anything reasonable.

In your case it'd be akin to saying that the sky is white because the sun is white, even though if you look at the sky on a clear day you'd know that to be blatantly false, yet you'd keep insisting that everyone else is wrong and you're right.

teo123 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 7:57 am Oh, but, you know, groupthink is at least as dangerous as trying to outsmart everybody else is. Groupthink is how Holocaust and Lysenkoism happened: they came from compliance, rather than uncompliance. I have yet to hear of a major catastrophe that happened from a lack of groupthink.

There's a pretty thick line between groupthink and believing what there is good reason to believe. You don't grasp this since you, even after six years of being educated, still don't understand the most basic principles of epistemology.

teo123 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 7:57 amFurthermore, I cannot pick and choose what I believe. Belief is a result of becoming convinced. I am not convinced by what a bunch of non-experts (in a multidisciplinary field nobody is qualified to talk about, such as pandemic response) think.

This is because you lack humility and an understanding of epistemology. You have to stop thinking you know more than experts. I don't know why I'm bothering to tell you this since you've been told that a thousand times and still nothing has come of it.

teo123 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 7:57 amDoes not that sound too terrifying to be true?

Isn't the Holocaust or modern slavery too terrifying to be true either? What about the fact that there are over 100 billion animals killed every year by the meat industry? What about the millions of children who die of preventable causes every year?

I thought you already learned this Teo; Just because something might make you uncomfortable doesn't mean it's false. That's the mindset of the average idiot who is too afraid to look reality in the eye and instead decides to escape to ideas of souls and denial of massacres.

Oh wait...

teo123 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 7:57 amAlso, don't the vast majority of physicists subscribe either to the Copenhagen Interpretation or the Pilot Wave Theory, not to the Many Worlds Interpretation?

As far as I can tell it's about equal support.

This.

Jebus wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 3:05 pm I am 99.9% sure that your suicide talk is simply an attempt to get some attention on a dying (much thanks to you) forum.

It just makes zero sense to believe that someone who is scared of needles, would have the courage to do himself in.

On the other hand, I have no doubt that you are suffering from mental issuess, and I stronly urge you to seek help.

Looks like Teo is scaredy of MWI too. I'll give props to @brimstoneSalad though. I've never heard anyone respond someone's suicidal thoughts with quantum mechanics.

Red wrote:I know, I know, you still think your reasons for believing that bombs and prisons don't exist were reasonable, but considering the scope of the conspiracy, AND the mountains empirical evidence otherwise, it doesn't come close to anything reasonable.

But if that is not reasonable, what is a reasonable guess then? I started with uncontroversial scientific and social-scientific premises, such as the Second Law of Thermodynamics and the Principle of Rationality.

Red wrote:In your case it'd be akin to saying that the sky is white because the sun is white, even though if you look at the sky on a clear day you'd know that to be blatantly false, yet you'd keep insisting that everyone else is wrong and you're right.

I do not quite understand your analogy.

Red wrote: You don't grasp this since you, even after six years of being educated, still don't understand the most basic principles of epistemology.

And what are those basic principles of epistemology? Something the vast majority of philosophers agree on?

Red wrote:This is because you lack humility and an understanding of epistemology.

What do you mean by "epistemology"? Do you think I should study a bit more philosophy? That studying philosophy is not a waste of time?

Red wrote: You have to stop thinking you know more than experts.

But what if everybody was thinking that way? Science would never advance, right? Do you think I should also give up my alternative interpretation of the names of places in Croatia?

Red wrote:Isn't the Holocaust or modern slavery too terrifying to be true either?

They are far less terrifying than the idea that every sentient being is immortal and suffers for an infinite amount of time.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 am But if that is not reasonable, what is a reasonable guess then? I started with uncontroversial scientific and social-scientific premises, such as the Second Law of Thermodynamics and the Principle of Rationality.

Yes, and then you drew conclusions that you can only believe if you were an intense combination of inane and insane.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 am I do not quite understand your analogy.

k.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 am And what are those basic principles of epistemology? Something the vast majority of philosophers agree on?

It's arrived at through logic (something else you don't understand), by understanding thing like trusting scientific consensus, knowing when and when not empirical evidence can prove something, etc.
I'm not going to explain this to you (mainly because it'd be a waste of time), so I'm just going to link this essay about street epistemology:
https://streetepistemology.com/#guide
No you don't have to read the whole thing, but just at least skim to get at least some idea.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 am What do you mean by "epistemology"? Do you think I should study a bit more philosophy? That studying philosophy is not a waste of time?

Studying real philosophy isn't a waste of time. Just give a quick look at the essay I linked, if you skim it shouldn't take more than 20 minutes.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 am But what if everybody was thinking that way?

Most people DO think they know more than experts, which is why we get things like anti-vaxxers, cholesterol skepticism, climate change denial, Anti-GMO protests, Anti-nuclear power sentiment, anti-COVID response policies, alternative medicine...
Yeah, it doesn't lead to very good things.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 amScience would never advance, right?

The vast majority of people are too ignorant of science to ever advance the field like that.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 amDo you think I should also give up my alternative interpretation of the names of places in Croatia?

Probably.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:05 am They are far less terrifying than the idea that every sentient being is immortal and suffers for an infinite amount of time.

So if something is too skeery it must be wrong right? Right.

Red wrote:Yes, and then you drew conclusions that you can only believe if you were an intense combination of inane and insane.

Well, I am quite sure Einstein's theory of relativity similarly sounded insane and inane to the vast majority of people.

Red wrote:

teo123 wrote:Do you think I should also give up my alternative interpretation of the names of places in Croatia?

Probably.

Uf, that will be a great sacrifice, because I have put a lot of effort into it. And don't you think my guess that "k(a/u)rr-" meant "to flow" in Illyrian is fundamentally different than all the other guesses I have made? I can estimate the p-value of it: it is somewhere between 1/300 and 1/17. I could not estimate the p-value of my guess that bombs or prisons did not exist. It is far more scientific.

Red wrote:So if something is too skeery it must be wrong right? Right.

I am glad we agree on that.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 30, 2022 3:05 am Well, I am quite sure Einstein's theory of relativity similarly sounded insane and inane to the vast majority of people.

If you aren't joking, this statement right here shows how little you've learned after countless attempts by us to educate you.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 30, 2022 3:05 am Uf, that will be a great sacrifice, because I have put a lot of effort into it. And don't you think my guess that "k(a/u)rr-" meant "to flow" in Illyrian is fundamentally different than all the other guesses I have made? I can estimate the p-value of it: it is somewhere between 1/300 and 1/17. I could not estimate the p-value of my guess that bombs or prisons did not exist. It is far more scientific.

Sir, this is a Wendy's.

teo123 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 30, 2022 3:05 am I am glad we agree on that.

Right, so anything too scary for us to think are real isn't true. Now THAT'S how you deal with reality.