Philosophical Vegan Forum

This is debate I got myself into (and I guess many of you did):

(After a long conversation about Christianity)
Someone: Bad things are going to happen to you. I know that because you work for the devil, and it is the source of all the evil in the world.
Me: I don't work for the devil, I don't even believe in the devil!
Someone: Yes, you do work for it by not believing in it. Now, repent, or you are going to end up in hell.
Me: Look, you certainly aren't going to convince me by threatening me (with hell). You have to show some evidence.
Someone: How dare you ask for a proof?! I am trying to save you from hell!
Me: Well, there are so many religions out there, you know.
Someone: Well, that means that there is a devil that deludes people to turn them away from Christ.
Me: How do you know?
(Shortly after...)
Someone: Don't be so arrogant. You are only 16 and you should stop behaving like you know everything.
Me: I am arrogant? Well, you've just claimed you can predict the future with absolute certainty (that bad things will happen to me because I don't believe in a God, that I will end up in hell…). I just can't think of something more arrogant than that.
Someone: That wasn't me, that was God speaking through me.
Me: What the hell does that even mean?!
Someone: Didn't you hear the difference?
Me: Of course not!
Someone: Then ask yourself why the Holy Spirit didn't let you to.
Me: Sorry to tell you, but you are totally crazy!

Eventually, it did shut her up, but I don't think that convinced her. So, what do you think, what would be a good response to her last question? I just can't think of any.

It's never happened to me. When i debate with christians we usually discuss God's morality, since it's impossible to prove wheter or not he actually exists.
Sometimes they try to prove he exists anyway, mostly through the inteligent design argument, and some other times they ask me for evidence of his nonexistance, which as we all know, is wrong.
The point is, most of my debates with them are about if God is good or not. So it hasn't happened to me.
But if it had i'd probably respond with something among the lines of "That was God speaking through you? Why don't you let Reason speak through you insted?" or something like that. But it also depends on who i'm talking to.

It's even more arrogant of them to claim god is speaking through them, or they're speaking for god. And mention don't forget to mention to these people that Muslims, and every other theistic religion's advocates, claim the same thing -- why not believe them instead, when they say the same thing?

Hey, this is about your mom, right?
That sounds really irritating. >.<

teo123 wrote:Someone: Don't be so arrogant. You are only 16 and you should stop behaving like you know everything.

The hypocrisy...

Maybe you should just not bother? It seems pretty obvious that she's totally closed-minded.

@ teo123,

"Someone" is obviously a servant of Loki, helping him to conspire against the other gods. She clearly is trying to do whatever she can to to help Loki slip free from his bonds, in time for the beginning of Ragnarok, so that he can fight against the gods (among the jotnar). I know this because Heimdallr speaks through me, and warns me that if she succeeds in helping Loki, that the two of them (Heimdallr and Loki) will end up slaying each other.

If you reveal to "Someone" that you know this dark secret of hers, as I've described it, she will probably deny it and say, "that's ridiculous, I don't even believe in Loki or the Norse gods". This denial, of course, really does demonstrate that she works for Loki, because she is working for him by not believing in him. If she still desperately tries to deny her service to Loki, tell her that you know this to be true because Heimdallr speaks through you.

Mateo3112 wrote:since it's impossible to prove wheter or not he actually exists.

You can disprove that God (Yahweh) exists if he is described as being omnipotent and / or omniscient. Can God create a rock so heavy he can't lift it? Does God know what God does not know? Can God create a circle square? Both of these properties contradict themselves, making the property impossible, and by extension, the being with said property impossible.

Wow! I've never actually had a face to face conversation like that, she sounds extremely daft. If I see someone online going off like that, I assume they're trolling. Like others have said, framing her way of thought in a different context may help. Maybe afterwards explain to her the concept of begging the question.

Cirion Spellbinder wrote: You can disprove that God (Yahweh) exists if he is described as being omnipotent and / or omniscient. Can God create a rock so heavy he can't lift it? Does God know what God does not know? Can God create a circle square? Both of these properties contradict themselves, making the property impossible, and by extension, the being with said property impossible.

But then they come to you with the special pleading fallacy, stating that he may be able to do so, but you just can´t imagine him doing so because it´s"Beyond human comprehension"

Mateo3112 wrote:But then they come to you with the special pleading fallacy, stating that he may be able to do so, but you just can´t imagine him doing so because it´s"Beyond human comprehension"

Do you think that's a valid line of reasoning?

Cirion Spellbinder wrote: Do you think that's a valid line of reasoning?

No, i do point out that their reasoning is wrong, but then they completely dissappear from the debate xD