Philosophical Vegan Forum

Adolf Hitler is often said by Fundamentalist Christians to be an Atheist, they say: "Einstein, Newton, Copernicus and Galileo were all Christians! Hitler, Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot were all Atheists! This shows that Atheists have no morality and Christians are lovely!" This argument is very fallacious. Firstly, they have only picked out a few Christians and a few Atheists. There are several lovely Atheists (Alan Turing, Stephen Hawking, Ed Miliband, etc.) and several evil Christians (KKK, Westboro, Josef Goebbels, etc.) so they have assumed an entire group of people's moralities based on the actions of a few. Secondly, the Bible itself says that nobody is righteous [*Romans 3:10] so according to a Fundamentalist Christian's own worldview, there is no difference between Hitler and Anne Frank. Both are dirty sinners deserving of Hell. Einstein was not a Christian (Einstein was a Deist, who believed in the God of Baruch Spinoza[*Reported by the New York Times 25 April 1929 under the headline "Einstein believes in 'Spinoza's God'"]) and Hitler was not an Atheist (Hitler said "We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out."[*Adolf Hitler, Speech in Berlin, October 24, 1933]). However, I am sure you all know this.

However, what you may not know is that Hitler may not have been entirely keen on Christianity either. Although he spoke of his Christian views in public, he didn't speak so kindly of it in private [*The quotes have been taken from the book, "Hitler's Table Talk"]:

“The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity’s illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew.”
"Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure."
"There is something very unhealthy about Christianity."

I do not think that Hitler was an Atheist, however I am not so sure that he was a Christian either. I think he was some sort of Pagan or other superstitious belief. I say this because he was quite fond of the German Faith Movement [*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Faith_Movement], a bizarre pagan personality cult based around Hitler and also the worship of the sun. However, this is only my conclusion. What do you think? Was Hitler a Christian, a Pagan, an Atheist or something else? Please leave your thoughts, I would love to hear them!

he was supposed to be vegan, or vegetarian as well, who knows... does it matter now?

vegan81vzla wrote:he was supposed to be vegan, or vegetarian as well, who knows... does it matter now?

It doesn't, but I find it fun to discuss. And yes, Hitler's diet was primarily vegetarian throughout the latter part of his life; however, he didn't adopt a vegetarian diet for moral reasons, but because he suffered from gastric problems.

well, I would say that it all depends on how does sell proclaimed christians, or the christian church would label him... I mean, the kkk might call themselves christians, but, do they consider Hitler as one? Or does the christian church consider the kkk a christian group? I guess it is all a matter of association, the same as with his vegetarianism. As you said, he might have, might have not tried a vegan/vegetarian diet late in his life for health issues, but did he really do all he did to promote veganism? were all nazis vegan, or willing to try a vegetarian diet just becuse their lider did? I guess that is where it all would come down to...

Einstein: A secular Jew who was at most a deist (as you noted), and certainly did not believe in a personal god and vocally rejected Christianity.
Newton: Certainly a Christian, although he had a much more modern view of Christianity than those at the time did, and he was an Alchemist; he spent much more time searching for the philosopher's stone than for god as far as I can tell; would they claim alchemy is valid then?

Those are the only two we're sure about, the others lived too early to really know.

Copernicus: Hard to say, since he didn't really have a choice in the matter. He may have been a humanist or a Catholic, he certainly had leanings to the former despite being in the church; his status in the church was probably more political, and he doesn't seem to have spent time on apologetics.
Galileo: Also hard to say, although clearly a skeptic (and certainly not a literalist Christian based on his writings against such), he may have been a deist. His membership in the church was likely a matter of political and social necessity due to the era.

Of the four, only Newton I would call a Christian. Copernicus probably a humanist (perhaps a deist), but maybe a Catholic. Galileo almost certainly (in my estimation) not a Christian, but a skeptic and a deist.

The Real Dizzy wrote:Adolf Hitler is often said by Fundamentalist Christians to be an Atheist,

Hitler was a "Christian", but not very orthodox. Probably a heretical Christian; his beliefs were decidedly religious and supernatural in nature. He believed in god and he revered "the Christ" as some kind of Arian savior. It's a little messy, because it depends on what you mean by "Christian". He certainly wasn't an atheist (as you noted, he hated atheists), or even a deist, though. His was a personal god.

Stalin and Pol Pot were atheists, and probably bad guys.

Mao was an atheist; he wasn't really a bad guy, though (not like the others). The history there is a little more complicated.
Wikipedia quotes a few good summaries of Mao:

Biographer Peter Carter described Mao as having "an attractive personality" who could for much of the time be a "moderate and balanced man", but noted that he could also be ruthless, and showed no mercy to his opponents.[120] This description was echoed by Sinologist Stuart Schram, who emphasised Mao's ruthlessness, but who also noted that he showed no sign of taking pleasure in torture or killing in the revolutionary cause.[117] Lee Feigon considered Mao "draconian and authoritarian" when threatened, but opined that he was not the "kind of villain that his mentor Stalin was".[285] Alexander Pantsov and Steven I. Levine claimed that Mao was a "man of complex moods", who "tried his best to bring about prosperity and gain international respect" for China, being "neither a saint nor a demon."[286]

So, even if you accept the premise of that argument, it kind of breaks down on examination.

The Real Dizzy wrote:

vegan81vzla wrote:he was supposed to be vegan, or vegetarian as well, who knows... does it matter now?

It doesn't, but I find it fun to discuss. And yes, Hitler's diet was primarily vegetarian throughout the latter part of his life; however, he didn't adopt a vegetarian diet for moral reasons, but because he suffered from gastric problems.

This seems to be the case (what The Real Dizzy said). Only a mostly vegetarian diet, but there are reports of him eating foul, and he received beef injections from his doctor.

He did love his dog, though. Nobody is pure evil.