Anonymous & WikiLeaks

[knot]

Do you view these groups as a source for good or bad?

[brimstoneSalad]

I view them as more symptomatic rather than sources of anything.

[knot]

Err, oops.. I meant to write "force for good/bad"

Symptomatic of what? Government surveilance and censorship? Celebrity culture?

It's hard for me to determine if they're accomplishing anything meaningful or just doing a lot of harm. I think that's partly because the real world doesn't correspond very easily to the internet. So if we take a concept like a police force (which I think is a very good thing), and we translate it to the internet, it might have to look something like the NSA even if it seems scary and Orwellian

[brimstoneSalad]

Wikileaks is just a website for people to post leaks. It's the people who want to leak documents who are doing good or bad.

I don't see Anonymous as having a very large impact on the world, although they have done quite a bit to expose Scientology, Scientology itself (while kind of nutty) is not very harmful. What else are they doing that you think is significant?

[knot]

Wikileaks is just a website for people to post leaks. It's the people who want to leak documents who are doing good or bad.

I thought Assange decided what to publish on there though? The line between legit whistle-blowing and treason is kinda unclear to me, but Douglas Murray makes some good points against Wikileaks here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emPIz7Sv1LE

I don't see Anonymous as having a very large impact on the world, although they have done quite a bit to expose Scientology, Scientology itself (while kind of nutty) is not very harmful. What else are they doing that you think is significant?

They've done some things that seem to be good, like tracking down ISIS members and child molesters and aiding in the Arab spring. I view most of their operations as bad though; e.g. them leaking thousands of private emails and passwords or their attacks on random corporations and government institutions that they didn't like, which have resulted in massive economic damage. I think they unknowningly behave and think like the fascists they pretend to oppose, and end up acting as judge, jury and executioner in many cases where they really don't have enough information to determine right from wrong

[brimstoneSalad]

Interesting. Sounds like it's too early to make a call on these things.

[Minos]

I think, that they hit their peak in the past when they were able to get people on the streets. That ended, when many "core" members were arrested for their crimes (which were, with no doubt actually commited). I recommend reading book "We are Anonymous" which describes events back then. In overall, I consider their actions more towards bad side (even though knot above mentioned very good examples of good actions).

As Annons have no hierarchy and anyone can do anything (within given ethics) they will be always source of both, good and bad. Internet and anonymity inspire evil in people (as many discussions and comments - "lower half of the internet" shows). My conclusion is, that they are source of more bad actions than good ones. But, as I seen in the past we need them, because the good actions can make huge impact, which can't be achieved other ways.

If there is any confusion due to lack of my language skills, then please post it. I'll try to clear it up.