Trump's vs Civil Liberties

[EquALLity]

Amendment I. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

The Bill of Rights has slowly been picked away at and/or made ineffective through torture, the republican party's theocratic agenda, corporate media and corporatism in general, the repeal of Habeas Corpus, warrantless wiretapping and spying, and using the Espionage Act to crush real journalism.

Throughout Donald Trump's entire campaign, he has thoroughly intimidated the media. At at least one of his rallies, he called journalists the worst people on Earth. He even personally named a specific journalist at his rally while she was there to intimidate her and other journalists.
That alone is a disaster for freedom of the press.

Now, Donald Trump is likely to appoint a man as the head of the CIA who has said we should EXECUTE Edward Snowden.
Regardless of whether or not you agree with the NSA program in which basically the entire US population (and much of the rest of the world, which is being treated even worse) is spied on in the name of combating terrorism - Edward Snowden merely exposed the truth. Trump may appoint a guy who will try to execute him. What kind of precedent does that send? Go against the government by exposing reality, and we murder you?
Think of how that will dissuade other people from whistle-blowing.

He's also a guy who made up a bunch of crazy conspiracy theories regarding Hillary Clinton and Benghazi. Unsurprisingly, he supports torture, and as Trump said during the primaries, he'll bring back waterboarding and things a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding.

These things are very troubling in and of themselves, and they also indicate how Donald Trump believes the government should be run. He's a populist, but he's also an authoritarian. He doesn't have respect for civil liberties.

What do you guys think?

[knot]

I wouldn't read too much into what he says. He's purposefully over the top to troll the media all day long. He also flip-flops on every issue on a daily basis. I guess we'll just have to wait and see what he actually does

[PsYcHo]

Throughout Donald Trump's entire campaign, he has thoroughly intimidated the media. At at least one of his rallies, he called journalists the worst people on Earth.

But....In this election, the media has done several things that go against there supposed impartiality. Meeting with the head of the DNC for example, or giving Hillary debate questions in advance. And remember, el Trumpo didn's ask the media to follow him, they just did. (Brought to you by Wikileaks, care of Edward Snowden. )

Now, Donald Trump is likely to appoint a man as the head of the CIA who has said we should EXECUTE Edward Snowden.
Regardless of whether or not you agree with the NSA program in which basically the entire US population (and much of the rest of the world, which is being treated even worse) is spied on in the name of combating terrorism - Edward Snowden merely exposed the truth.Trump may appoint a guy who will try to execute him.

There is a big difference between want to and try to. I want to murder the person who invented the alarm clock, but I won't try to.

What kind of precedent does that send? Go against the government by exposing reality, and we murder you?
Think of how that will dissuade other people from whistle-blowing.

He hasn't murdered him yet. I actually share your concern about his opinions ( ), but when you imply that the murder of Snowden is imminent if Trump appoints him, you dilute your argument with the same water that conspiracy theorist use. Your argument isn't invalid, but it is too suppository. Be vigilant and voice your concerns, but if you truly want to make people consider a position, remember you are not arguing to those who agree with you.

These things are very troubling in and of themselves, and they also indicate how Donald Trump believes the government should be run. He's a populist, but he's also an authoritarian. He doesn't have respect for civil liberties.

Obama wants to take our guns. Hillary defends child rapists. Lizard people run the New World Order. I'm just making statements that support a position I've already taken.

Those of us on this forum that know your position understand where you are coming from, but someone who doesn't know your positions may be curious as to why He doesn't have respect for civil liberties..

Do you want an echo chamber where people agree with you, or do you want to convince those who disagree?

[brimstoneSalad]

I don't think anybody gave Hillary the questions in advance for the Trump debates, she did pretty terribly on a lot of the questions; she's just that much better at thinking on her feet than he is.

The point about alienation is important; we most need to convince people we disagree with, and that means being sickeningly charitable to Trump and other republicans. We have to keep our distance from rhetoric.

Some of those comments are bad, but he's also made some positive comments. We'll have to see what he actually does, since he's been all over the place.

[PsYcHo]

I don't think anybody gave Hillary the questions in advance for the Trump debates, she did pretty terribly on a lot of the questions; she's just that much better at thinking on her feet than he is.

I believe she is a better liar than he is. To be clear, they are BOTH liars, but it is easier to see when he is lying. (IMO)

The point about alienation is important; we most need to convince people we disagree with, and that means being sickeningly charitable to Trump and other republicans. We have to keep our distance from rhetoric.

Considering the fact that he is currently considering (and likely going to choose) Mitt Romney as Secretary of State leads me to believe he isn't as "thin skinned" as people believe. Coming from a supervisory background, you choose the people who can help you the most if you want to succeed, and you tell those who can influence your position what they want to hear. Perhaps if you want to change the dirty game, you have to play in the mud first..(supposition, of course. )

Some of those comments are bad, but he's also made some positive comments. We'll have to see what he actually does, since he's been all over the place.

Chuck Shumer seemed hesitantly optimistic, and I'm siding with him. Let's wait and see.