Relationships

[Unknownfromheaven]

Hello.

I know that in this category is about fun things, but in life, we can also encounter other issues that are not so pleasant.

I think it's important in life to communicate with people, especially those who are close to us.
The purpose of this thread now is to exchange experiences and talk to each other to ensure common, positive goals when it comes to personal life.
At least this is what I hope.

So, don't be afraid to open up and eventually share your personal experience.

This is mine...

It's been a long time since I joined this forum, and now I feel that is a good thing for me to explore it once again, among other things, It's one of the things that I needed. The reason of my inactivity was as you could expect, life itself.
I got two jobs in the meantime and was very busy doing things. I started a business, bought an apartment, a parking lot and furniture and all of that which is needed to make a cozy place.

The issues are that for many years I suffered and tolerated a lot of things from my ex-wife, hoping that things will be better and that she will change.
I will give you some examples. In 13 years, 90% of the time, I was the one who was cooking, washing the dishes and cleaning the kitchen, she even bragged about this on Facebook with one occasion. I did these because I love to cook, this is how I am and also was against the patriarchal mentality that most people have in my country.

Between 2007 and 2020 (now it got way worse than before) she talked with strangers, for hours (some of the conversations were about sex) she also accepted invitations from strangers, to go to concerts with them or whatnot... while me, I couldn't even say "hello!" to my female neighbors, I couldn't talk with any girl, normally. It happened at some point to have a small conversation with an artist about music, and she erased the conversation and nagged my brain about it for a very long time.

Another case was that at some point a girl came to my neighborhood and she was very knowledgeable in Theology and a friend asked me to come outside to talk with this person. I accepted because I wanted to talk about that topic (without anything else in my mind). After we formed the group, later, somehow I found myself alone with this one, she politely asked me to drive her to her block because she was afraid of some guys who were outside and were yelling, the location was very close.

Since she was 17 years old, I endorsed her request, being polite and educated, to take her safety as my responsibility and to leave her home safe and sound. Problem was that at that moment when we arrived the girl told me she was in love with me. I explained what were my intentions and made her understand that the conversation we had was not an encouragement to have some form of intimate connection, that I was already in a relationship. She understood and that was it.

Later I spoke with my ex-wife, and from that moment on, she would argue with me, every day, month after month, year after year... without having other subjects to talk about.
So you see? Nothing happened, I was polite but this led her to think that I was lying to her with something or that I am cheating on her. Which really, wasn't the case.

The first year of our relation was a little bit odd since I didn't find that behaviour to be normal, she was talking with some punks who insulted me and told me that they can have her anytime. This made me upset and I asked her to ignore those people and to surround herself with other kind of people.
Except that...
I never controlled her and always gave her what she wanted, freedom, space, to be able to do what she wants, again my toleration of these were because I thought that she will understand things and eventually focus on her priorities but this didn't happen. Also she had a talent to create unrealistic scenarios and issues that were not happening. She would sometimes yell at me or even hit me for no reason. I didn't felt respect from her part, and I tried to understand why this would be the case considering that she grew up without her biological father and also she had hearing problems.
My expectations were too high, it seems, for her to understand me. She also made a credit behind my back for her mother to have a store. One that I paid when I found out.
I will not go into details about her parents, even if they too had an impact on me and made me unhappy, too many times.

So, when I got upset, and sometimes lost my cool in the sense that I raised my tone about specific issues, she said that it isn't normal.

All the people I spoke with about this, told me this was a toxic relationship (she actually admitted that she was) She told me she wasn't fair, that I am a strong person and that no other man would have endured what I did... Her words.
One night she begged me: "Please let me f*ck this guy... that all girls want this. I had no words to that, Later, I questioned her to tell me more and she asked me: "Who wouldn't want to do this? To drink whiskey, smoke some marihuana and f*ck three guys" as she was pushing me to go somewhere else with one of my friends while she would leave with these guys, alone, in another country.

This made me feel like an alien... I went home in my former city to let her see how it is without me, I got sick because of this, was in the hospital and she didn't search for me, she didn't came to see me. and so on and so forth.

What I am doing now it's not a complain, I am not doing that, but I feel the need to let it out because I felt that no one understood me, except very close friends and my family. I know it's my fault that I allowed so many things to even make me doubt myself, too often and to lose my self-esteem in the process. But, my understanding and hope that I had, placed me on a different, higher frequency (since I am a meditator for 18 years in a row) and although I have great intuition, sometimes I fail to sense these people if they are in my own den. But she became very obvious with what she told me.

So, I found out eventually that she was cheating on me, I always waited for her with a warm meal when she returned home, after midnight, when I had time off, I was spending a lot of time with my child, while she was having fun. So often, it was so late when I came home from my workplace which was mainly with night shifts and discovered her chatting with the boys at 4 AM in the morning, with no food in the house... Again, I had to cook, and for her, even if I was very tired.

She told me very late that she stopped loving me five years ago (this was in 2019 - something that I felt but didn't want to accept) so, six years... and that she stood with me due to the lack of other options... and she was going out with these guys and of course you know the rest of the details.

I was thinking mostly about my child, wanting to change things around and to be better, as a family. I never cheated on her and always spoke my mind about some issues, in a calm, civilized manner. I know it was a mistake to ignore things that bothered me for so long, but again, I was hoping.
My mistake is that I didn't hold to the center those times, I would stomp on me for the greater good of things and if that's in extremes, it can make your life miserable.

I actually told her several times " I want you to be happy and to have what you desire, but that doesn't mean I have to be miserable for you to achieve these things." No balance came even though I struggled... but the more you want to fix something, or hope and involve yourself into something, the uglier ways it will take... If there is something I learned from this (even though, it may not apply to all people) is that I have to be a little bit selfish, but not too selfish. I really hated this before, but now I finally understand why the Ego is after all important.
It is to discover or to recognize your own value and what you are made of, what you bring to the table and what mentality you have. To have standards for yourself, etc.
This was an ugly effect from meditation because, for me, it made me detach completely from my needs or concerns, to accept everything where we don't have to, ignoring the issues for the greater good. So, I think it's good to have limits and not to allow someone to mock you in this particular fashion, for so long, as I allowed.

I forgave her about most stuff and gave her chance after chance to change some things but she didn't do anything. I was wounded and it hurts still, because of my child which I don't see as often as I would want.

In the meantime at my former workplace, there was a girl that I really liked a lot, but I didn't had any sexual desires or something that would endanger my marriage at that time, I wanted to know her and to talk, eventually, she understood what were my issues, I felt that she cared for me and this gave me hope that I can rebuild my life with someone right this time. It meant a lot for me because I knew that with my ex-wife I wasn't going anywhere. I knew what will happen and that the divorce was something that I cannot avoid.

Because I received a specific education, I knew how to treat things in this life and to have empathy and compassion for the people around me. Yet, my sensitive nature made me feel afraid of the deaths of the ones I know and love because I discovered how many people are dying and in what ways. some very unexpected, a lot of things can happen in life. I thought that building a pillar for myself would help me eventually to get through the deaths of the ones I love. Yet that pillar was destroyed as you can figure it out from I wrote above.

It was not very late that what I felt for this girl became love eventually because of many personal reasons. Now I am thinking at the new pillar that I want to build with her, slowly.

I left everything for my child and came back to my former city to go through this pain I was feeling.

It is said (it seems) that women make rules for Beta males and break them for Alpha. At least this is what I was able to find online about these issues...
I never thought about these things before, as I never considered myself Alpha or Beta, I was thinking of myself as a human being.

I apologize for the length of this post, but I couldn't treat it in a superficial way.
Normally I am not a fan of these things that women do to complain about their husbands online, or on forums, but in my case, these things are not current, it's my past now and this is how I will treat it, I don't want it to affect my future.

I am focusing more on my fresh perspectives, to be able to extra provide for my child and this girl which is very special to me.

I wish you well and good health!

[brimstoneSalad]

I'm sorry that happened to you. As you recognized, it seems those alternative sources on relationships and meditation kind of lead you astray.

It sounds like you would benefit from reading some more mainstream sources on relationships, and the key to that is usually communication, but it's also a two way street of self-improvement.
Your wife may have been bipolar and it sounds like she needed professional help. For your part, it sounds like you enabled her mistreatment of you and tried to suppress your feelings, letting it bubble up until you became angry -- either silent stoicism or yelling, and neither is effective communication.

[Unknownfromheaven]

For your part, it sounds like you enabled her mistreatment of you and tried to suppress your feelings, letting it bubble up until you became angry -- either silent stoicism or yelling, and neither is effective communication.

Thanks for the response, it means a lot to me.

It was indeed like you've said. I am a very calm person, it takes much to anger me. Ad-hominem usually does that to me especially if it's unreasonable and she insulted me with a lot of things (that I didn't mention in this post), many things happened but these things that I wrote and expressed were the worst for me and when I challenged her to argument her behavior she laughed in my face. So you're right, because I thought of the greater good (mostly my child) and what I wanted to accomplish (the pillar), I kept suppressing what was affecting me. I ignored those aspects for a greater cause or an ideal which was an illusion. I know that was a big mistake and I learned a lot from this relationship.

All humans have a nervous system and those kinds of reactions are normal, but when she said that it wasn't normal in contrast with what she was doing to me with those several examples, it made me feel like an alien.

Another example. I had to go to work for a shift of 12 hours in a day, my child was saying:" mommy, mommy!" and she was talking with a stranger she just met two days before and she was ignoring me and the child... I was sitting right next to her for about two or three minutes and she was smiling and laughing, ignoring us both.

When I got upset and told her about these, that I didn't forbid her to talk with someone on the net... but it was not the right moment and that it would be good for her and for us to focus on her main priorities... So, you see, I was calm and argumented that context even if I was upset.

When I referred to the Ego, I meant about self-esteem/ self-worth, confidence. I was against Ego because I always considered that it's the cause of man's inhumanity to man, that all of the suffering in the world is a consequence of that... But as I meditated on these issues I realized there is a big distinction. That's why I said it's ok to be a little bit selfish but not too selfish and that this may not apply to all people.

Like Bob Marley said:" All people will hurt you in this life, it's important to make the difference and to see who is worth suffering for"
or something like that, this is what I remember.

You've also said, to inform myself on these topics, to learn and improve myself...I agree, this is in fact what I've done and continue to listen to people.
I found out that women confuse confidence with narcissism and silly arrogance. I don't agree with those behaviors.

Except for this girl that I mentioned before that proved herself to me with many things and that she is indeed way different than most women... the more I learn about women the less I want to continue. It's a feeling that I cannot deny because I am afraid since it's about our life choices and we have this only one life... I think about things on the long run, I was never superficial about these things, some people (like my ex-wife) are superficial and don't think about the implications and what will follow... my problem is that I know beforehand what will happen... like for instance that some people will die at some point, and I am trying to prepare myself to be able to face that reality and be strong when it will happen.

It sucks.

Dr. Jordan Peterson stated at some point that seeking absolute happiness in a relationship is absolutely delusional and that the true purpose of these is to have someone besides you to make you stronger, to be with you and face the hostility of life together and if love is involved that's the best for it.
So this is why I forgive mostly, I know that humans are not perfect, more than that I know that I am not perfect and I try to always seek the best in everything, thinking and hoping that things can improve and that people will start to realize and mature in the process... the only problem is that my ex-wife didn't.

So from my experience, at least... if someone is in a toxic relationship and is not respected by their girlfriend or wife... it should end with the first occasion.

[Unknownfromheaven]

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[Unknownfromheaven]

For your part, it sounds like you enabled her mistreatment of you

It only made it worse... she was already behaving in that way without having respect for our relationship. I didn't think it was normal for her to speak with strangers for four or five hours, while I was cooking and minding the work I was doing in the house.
As I said, she was like that from 2007. While I was communicating with her most of the time about these issues and tried to find a solution, I seldom told her that it bothered me and despite that, she kept going on with these conversations. And when I did the same thing for five minutes, she went insane...(rules for Beta) So, she wasn't looking at her behavior (broke rules for Alpha) but went mad when I spoke with a girl even if it wasn't about sex like her many conversations were.

I also told her at some point that I could understand her behavior if I was to cheat on her or to mock her like other guys were doing... but it wasn't the case.
Again, she made different unrealistic scenarios to argue with me, so basically, we argued over nothing
Although I was calm and always tried to provide arguments about why it wasn't the case and told her that these things are nothing, it didn't solve anything. She was just laughing (because she knew I was right) but the thing is that when someone is laughing at me or insults me, these can trigger me because of some old traumatic experiences I had in my childhood.

I simply cannot stand such things, but usually if that happens to me, I go outside to take some fresh air and stargaze, to relax and dodge the anger you mentioned, although this was only sometimes on serious issues, and of course to relax my nervous system from intense situations.
Other times when I explained tons of stuff and wrote to her, just to assure that I'm clear, because in a face to face conversation, she had moments when she didn't understand me and I had to repeat myself.

Still, she was ignoring what I was writing, she wasn't paying attention to the explanations.
Whenever I was right with something, she would bring other things to argue about and kept dodging me, and because I knew this really well, sometimes I preferred peace and not to explain anything. Thinking that all will pass and everything will be alright.

It reminded me of what Sam Harris mentioned at some point: "How do you use reason or evidence with someone who doesn't value reason or evidence?"

It doesn't work.

I always spoke my mind about these issues but hid that I was disturbed (when I was suppressing my feelings).

I also found out that she wanted a place for her to stay, the apartment I left for her, I didn't want to split or argue about material things and all that I got, because for me, the mental health of my child was and still is important, which proved that I was not invested in a materialistic view, because she told me she always moved from one place to another and she wanted stability, her own place, so the lack of options that she told before was a lie.

Then she told me she loved that guy and that she didn't love me for a very long time, at first she said from 2012, then she said 2014... it was not always the same answer but it didn't matter for me because she claimed that she said she loved me by reflex and from her actions I could tell.
I didn't felt love.

I was wrong to try things and not leave her on some occasions because there were many, but I thought that things could change If I am more mature and get over those things, even though these were not small issues.