Adam and Eve

[ChipDipSM]

The story of Adam and Eve is one I've discussed with a few different people and I'm curious to know what others think. I assume that everyone at least knows the basics of the story, so I guess that doesn't need to be stated.

My general observations are as followed:
-Adam and Eve did not know it was wrong to disobey god. He told them they were not allowed to eat from the tree, but lacking the ability to tell right from wrong they did not know it was wrong to disobey.
-God was the first to tempt them into eating from the tree. In the vast garden he pointed out one tree that they might have never laid eyes on. In addition he did not, to my knowledge, explain why they should not eat from the tree, aside from the fact that he said not to.
-They were banished from their home for disobeying god when they did not know that was wrong to do until after the fact.
-Despite both Adam and Eve eating from the tree, only Eve received additional punishment in the form of pain from child birth.

A particular friend tried to explain it to me by explaining it like this.

Look at god as a father, the tree as a stove, and Adam and Eve as children.
God lit the stove, and to protect his children he told them not to touch it. When he wasn't looking Eve touched it and burnt herself, not wanting to be alone she got Adam to touch it as well. God then felt he had to discipline their disobedience.

I countered this by telling her how my dad taught me not to touch the stove when it's on. My dad has always had me help in the kitchen, along with my two brothers and one sister. When each of us got to be about five years old he started teaching us to cook. The first thing he did was turn on the stove and show us how to tell when it was on. He then warned us of the danger it could cause and carefully showed us to feel the warmth of the stove. I've always been a hands on person and naturally wanted to see how it could get worse. One day I touched one of the burners and naturally burned myself. He did not yell at me or get mad, instead he treated the burn and made sure I was okay, then asked me if I learned my lesson. He sure as hell didn't kick me out of the house and threaten to kill me if I returned.

My argument has always been simple, either god is just a terrible father or he set them up to fail.

[Insert name here]

This basically sums up my opinion of the entire myth. It is no more than a Bronze Age myth about creation and why the world is not perfect, it seems as though is was designed to make people hate themselves, guilt tripping them into asking God for forgiveness. There is really nothing more to say, other than the main point that can be drawn from this story is that knowledge is evil, and that humans should live by faith. That's is some pretty bad advice if you ask me.

[brimstoneSalad]

-Adam and Eve did not know it was wrong to disobey god. He told them they were not allowed to eat from the tree, but lacking the ability to tell right from wrong they did not know it was wrong to disobey.

Correct.

-God was the first to tempt them into eating from the tree. In the vast garden he pointed out one tree that they might have never laid eyes on. In addition he did not, to my knowledge, explain why they should not eat from the tree, aside from the fact that he said not to.

Incorrect. He told them they would surely die if they did so.

-They were banished from their home for disobeying god when they did not know that was wrong to do until after the fact.

This is a matter of debate even among Abrahamic theists.
That's not the only interpretation.
Another is that, after they ate from the tree, they sinned knowingly -- and it was THAT small sin that occurred after eating that was the cause of their banishment.

Some point out that they looked upon each other with lust after eating, some that they felt shame and covered their nakedness (which they didn't know before), and also that in so doing, they sinned by wasting.
So many concepts of what that first "sin" really was. But suffice it to say, many theists do not agree that it was the actual eating of the fruit that was the sin (except perhaps the most foolish among them).

Bear in mind, that the YHWH of the old testament was not an all-powerful being. He was one among a pantheon, also subject to certain rules and limitations inherent in the universe.
Elohim (plural) created the world. YHWH was one among them, who later became the patron deity of the Israelites, later demanding that they have no other gods before him. The Jews were Polytheitstic, then Henotheistic. Monotheism is a relatively modern contrivance.

[ChipDipSM]

Incorrect. He told them they would surely die if they did so.

Thanks for the correction, it's been awhile since I read the story.

[Adien22]

So then god was the first to sin technically. If god told them they would die if they ate the fruit, but then they didn't, he lied to them. And according to god himself, lying is a sin

[brimstoneSalad]

So then god was the first to sin technically. If god told them they would die if they ate the fruit, but then they didn't, he lied to them. And according to god himself, lying is a sin

They did die. He didn't say they'd die right away: when they ate of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, they were expelled from the garden and became mortal.

In Abrahamic theology, the reason we suffer and die is widely interpreted to be original sin.
"the wages of sin is death"

[PsYcHo]

One of the main reasons I left the faith in the first place wasn't just disbelief, it was God seemed like a pretty mean guy. His "tests" were terrible. Sacrifice your son without question, kill your family to see if you still worship me, if not, eternal damnation. Doesn't seem like the type of person I'd want to spend all of eternity worshiping.

[eloine]

the Jews took the ancient Summerian myths and re-wrote them to give to women the sinful, evil , incomplete and impure role because they were misogynist, and all the religions (jewish, muslim and christians) are misogynist .

"god" created Eve from Adam's rib (that is quite humiliating to women, it basicly says that women are dependant of men), and Eve is made responsible (not Adam), for eating the apple and so they accused women of fall from paradise and at the same time blamed women for all the pain, misery and sufferings of the world
it is quite a lot of accusations and pressure for someone just made from a man's rib.

That is the reason why our world is so sick, torturing the most "physically" fragiles because misogyny is what built our society
Religions made us accepting in our subconscious that women are guilt

[eloine]

One of the main reasons I left the faith in the first place wasn't just disbelief, it was God seemed like a pretty mean guy. His "tests" were terrible. Sacrifice your son without question, kill your family to see if you still worship me, if not, eternal damnation. Doesn't seem like the type of person I'd want to spend all of eternity worshiping.

yes they invented a mean and revengeful god not hesitating to kill women and children and to make war.
because "agressivity" and "violence" is sign of power to men and
Because by the time they were not very evolved human beings
that's why for a lot of men not eating meat still today is associated as "weakness" or being "pussy" and "feminine"..because killing animals is showing how powerful you are so they always find as an excuse for not giving up meat that lions also eat meat, because they like to compare themselve to aggressive and strong animals and get the feeling they are powerful

and since the dawn of time men have been exploiting and martyrising the weakest and the most fragile

[eloine]

"the story of Eve has provided men with the reason why they should restrain and restrict the social, sexual, religious, political, and economic freedom of women. It has also given men the justification to hold women responsible for all the misfortunes suffered by mankind. "

http://witcombe.sbc.edu/eve-women/1evewomen.html

All women are like Eve, and their only chance of redemption is to become like the Virgin Mary, another patriarchal fantasy, who represents absolute obedience and purity. The story of Eve and its many misogynistic interpretations have over the centuries defined the image of woman in Western civilization.